Not fun stuff

We talk about heavy, heavy topics today. Police brutality and the need for reform. If you’d rather not listen to some tough subject matter today, we totally get it. It’s ok to skip this one. Just know, we love you :)

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SUMMARY KEYWORDS

people, talking, police officer, happening, kickball, police, law enforcement, calling, police force, downtown, remember, aaron, osage county, community, crime, home, floor, posts, area, training

SPEAKERS

Collin, Aaron, Brandon

Collin  00:05

Well, hello, everybody. Welcome to Oh brother, a podcast of three brothers trying to figure it all out with your hosts, Brandon, Collin. And Aaron. This week's show is a pretty serious one, we cover some really heavy topics. So if listening to a conversation around police brutality, wrongful deaths and murders, and what we as a society are trying to grapple with through these times, if that kind of conversation is disturbing, or maybe not something you'd necessarily want to listen to right now. You can go ahead and skip this one. We totally understand. If you'd like to go ahead and listen in on our conversation. We absolutely love that and we'd love to get your feedback on your thoughts. So again, this is Brandon, Aaron and myself, trying to figure out and talk out our feelings in how we are trying to understand everything that's going on right now in the United States. We just witnessed we were just downtown so the restaurant opened up some what they're calling fresco seating. So seating right on the road.

Brandon  01:16

Yeah. Otherwise there's outside seating outside seating.

01:18

I know I was like, a fancy restaurant with it like cresco CD. I was like,

Brandon  01:22

No, they just try to make it sound good.

01:24

It's just that it just means outside. It's what they actually did is they took away some parking spaces right in front of their restaurant and put a little elevated deck area like to make it even with the sidewalk and put some rails around it is really nice. And that's mostly so called wouldn't trip and fall. That's the gotcha. And I saw that they posted they're like, hey, our fresco seating is available starting today and I was like, I have the proceedings that we we went and we were the first ones there on the patio. I think that was kind of cool. Like, we We get to be the first one of the first real guests to come out and see this. And then we started to see well, when we were driving up to find a parking space, I noticed there were a ton of cars. I was like, That's crazy. It is five o'clock. Why are all these Oh, oh, I in my brain immediately flashed back to previously in the day I had seen a Facebook post in one of the groups of the town that was like, Hey, everybody, we're holding a riot and protest tonight downtown for the death of this lady who was wrongfully killed by a police officer. And earlier in the day, I had seen this gone Hmm, I should probably stay away from downtown. My brain completely forgot all about that. And then at four o'clock, I was like, ooh, let's go downtown. So we set out on our fresco seating, listening to people march around the courthouse picketing and screaming and yelling and left. Well, I mean, yes, we ate, we ate and then they go. So right in the thick of it, like, like, what was interesting people over there and one of the things was as

Brandon  03:22

was it somebody there in town

03:24

that does was it like no as a young lady named Anna Pfizer. She was shot and killed by a police deputy. a traffic stop after she ran a red light is 25 year old lady. And reports are saying that she claimed to have a gun and reached t reached for something and he shot her. Apparently he shot her five times a gang there is another interesting about the city and the county that I live They tried having body cams and dash cams before, but but the data management side, that's something that people don't consider a lot of is you have to store those files somewhere and keep them secure. Yeah, that came that was the part that was too much for the city. They were having technical difficulties, so they can to the project.

04:22

And now

04:25

a lot of people are left with these questions of what happened and nobody nobody knows. When they searched the car. They did not find a gun. So yeah, unfortunate. It's it's really, really sad. It's really terrible. Um, but now, you know, cops are getting their addresses put out there and people are threatening their children and some wonderful stuff happening

04:54

in the area in response to this, so

Brandon  04:58

good. times people. Yeah. Well, I would say that step is a bit too far. But I don't see anything wrong with demonstrating downtown to be mad about that. This is I mean, this is the, you know, if your job is to serve and protect the people of the community, but you're going to that is going to be your response. You're not serving or protecting anybody. You're definitely not protecting anybody by doing that. In my opinion, this is my opinion. I do not speak for any of the other two on this show. This is just me. All eat this one. That's fine. You guys can disavow me all you want. But I think that response is just so outside. And I understand that this is a profession where it's Very high stress. Okay. But I think the thing that people are not talking about, and something that is really important to consider here is, why are you so afraid that that is your response? Right, because that's a fear response. That's not anything else. That is a fear response. What are you afraid of? What has made you so afraid that your first response to some sort of situation is pull gun shoot? Right? Right, what has conditioned you to be dis afraid? And why are you not getting counseling? Why is there not enough? Why is nobody focusing on that aspect for these people that are trying to be out there protecting the service? Why are they not getting enough mental health? mental health help? Right?

06:55

Well, I mean, that's, that's true, because they do. They run the gamut. I mean, was Have you had this incident happen in just a few days beforehand? They This is okay. This is a content warning. Not fun stuff. Somebody a gentleman, not even gentlemen. He's a monster. Just south of where we live up abducted his girlfriend three times. Each time doing two Yeah, she would escape. Yeah, he would capture her. He would put her her in his basement and like, strung her up and was like, like, like, mutilating her Lord. And and so you have the same people dealing with that man

Brandon  07:43

as that are

07:44

pulling over 25 year old woman on the side of the road because she ran a red light. Something needs to change. Right like that is that is not okay.

Brandon  07:53

Yeah. And I think that's that's the thing that's getting lost in the in the discourse. About the defund the police thing, right? A lot of that doesn't mean abolish police forces. It doesn't mean get rid of all police officers.

08:13

Some people want that we have to clearly state that something that's true. Can you really want that? Well, I mean, in sound good that you Chazz?

Brandon  08:20

Well, I mean, look, in some areas of the country is getting rid of a large portion of your police force may be a good idea. Yeah, I think I think it's fair to say that might be true. You know, based on things that I've read about some of the police forces in certain areas, could some of those guys maybe just not be doing that job anymore? Yeah, I think that would be beneficial to the community at large. Not in areas like, as far as I'm aware, I'm very ignorant on these things in my local area, but like here, it's not really a thing that's happening right. We have a very strong All police force. It's not super big. But, you know, I think what most people are calling for the majority of people that I have read it's it's mostly about taking that money. It's going to the police force. Maybe not buying tanks and armored assault vehicles, you know, and redistributing that money to where it's not the same people doing that. Having more officers and then dividing it up between like, you know, counselors and like family service people, so there's more of them to deal with certain calls and other things right. So that there's not just one small group or large group people dealing with all the same all that different variety of things, you know, I mean, oh, yeah, no, I it's

09:58

right on the money is what I think have just there needs to be a lot more diversity of help for the communities and just more help, because because I mean, I know that phrase, you know, thin blue line, I think that that's a bit possibly a bit overplayed. I mean, yes, there are there are monsters out there. That's

Brandon  10:18

what I detected from. Again, I think I think we get fed only the bad stuff. Right? So we feel, I mean, part of this is propaganda based. And part of this is just what sells in the news, right? if no one's gonna watch the news, and they can't sell ad space if you don't get sensationalized headlines. But I think the majority of criminals out there are not serial rapists and mass murderers. You know, the counter argument to that someone will say, Well, that's because we have, you know, all the police. It's like, No, I think it's because people generally aren't that awful, right? I think

11:03

it's at Simpsons skit where Lisa has the rock and she's like, this rock protects me from tigers and Homer goes, Lisa, there are no Tigers over here. And she holds it to rock. And he goes, Lisa, I'd like to buy that rock.

Brandon  11:15

Yeah, that's that's kind of what I think. Right. So the argument counter argument will be. Some people will say, Well, the reason we don't have crime is because we have all the police in that room. No, not really. That's really how that works. It's not a lot of studies about crime have shown that. That doesn't really do that. Right. The fact that your police officers have assault weapons, doesn't make you have less crime in the area. Right. Things like poverty rates. And in housing availability. These are the kind of things that increase crime rates, right when people can't meet their basic needs of life. These This is what drives crime. Right? Most people that have

12:06

an OK income and

Brandon  12:09

are not super worried about being able to provide for themselves or their family, they're not sitting at home going, you know, I'm bored, let's go crime. Right unless they're like a 14 year old This is sure, but that's like, I'm gonna go spray paint a car. Not like, I'm gonna go stab somebody you know what I mean? So I think No, it's very, it's very, I this is one of those things that unfortunately, the complexity of the issue gets lost in the shouting discourses. But I I do tend to believe that there are instances where police departments are definitely in the wrong. Right. I think there is a culture in certain areas. Again, this is not a thing against all police officers. Obviously not best silly, but there are roots running deep in some police departments, maybe more than I'm aware of probably more than I'm aware of. But to be honest, because I don't have interaction with law enforcement everyday. Right? I barely even see police officers in my day to day life. That's just you know, one of the things that I apparently need to be thankful for in my life is that it's not a thing that I have to deal with. But I do definitely believe that there are some instances. There are instances in this country where there are bad police institutions. And something does need to be done about them. Because we can't have police killing systems. This is not that that's that doesn't good. I don't care if they are criminals. The police's job is to not not to kill citizens. Right? It's not your job. Right? Your job is to apprehend and then have a trial. Right?

14:12

Yeah, they're not the they're not the judge, jury and executioner. Yeah, they're, you know, they're just bringing people in so they can have their day in court and have that system. We have that system for a reason. And, you know, you started off talking about that sense of fear. And I do think that comes from a lot of the culture that you mentioned in many of the many I'm gonna say in some of the forces around the country where the unions are so strong. I mean, that's I mean, they're almost invincible in pieces, you know, they can I

Brandon  14:48

think that's part of the issue behind the defund the police thing. Like if you abolish your police department, that the union can't fire you because it's not it doesn't exist anymore. Right now. Kind of the drastic step of just like chop and then you start a new police force.

15:06

Right? Well, I don't be they've been, they've been pointing to what it was in Cincinnati or something like that, where they fired every single one of their police officers in New Jersey.

Brandon  15:15

There's one city in New Jersey,

15:17

and then and then hired them all, but then started hiring people back get back we had to reapply. Yeah. And it was a way of busting out essentially busting the union. So that so that you could actually have an I mean, there you go. You actually have real world market forces applied to, to job performance. And yeah, and how things were conducted, as opposed to having this artificial limiter on what could or couldn't be done to people.

Brandon  15:50

Yeah. You know, I think that Yeah, I like a lot of other people have read that case study. And you see that they invested a lot in community. involvement and community building and a lot more other things, you know, not just, they actually like

16:09

tripled investment in quote unquote, police. But what the definition of police was on the other side was not what it was coming into it.

Brandon  16:20

Yeah. And I think I think a lot of that, too gets convoluted in the definition of between crime and criminal. Right, like, people conflate those two things like, oh, crime is bad. Yes, that's true. Are all criminals bad? That's no, right. Because a lot of crime quote unquote, crime is like, you know, theft or something. It's not really like that the worst thing ever. So these are things that are you know, drug possession. That's all of the conversation we can have later. But that's a whole weird thing where, you know, they just like, Oh, you do crime, you are a criminal, you must be the worst thing ever. And you know, this again, this is a multi facet layer thing with like, you know, police reform, prison reform and how that's just like a mess. I'm not sure how you're supposed to become a better person when they lock you in a tiny cell and don't give you any food or water or light ever. That makes you not crime. Not sure about that. You know, yeah, just kind of a, a whole broken thing. It has to start somewhere. And there's a lot of people who aren't willing to even have a discourse. That's why you have a lot of anger and stuff because again, this is one of the things this is not a new problem. You know, this same thing has happened. untold multitudes of times that you have no idea about. But I definitely see how there are definitely communities where you just you've had enough, right? I mean, good lord Rodney King was almost well over 2020 years ago. Yep. And same thing still happening in some places, right? Gotta be sick of that stuff. If you see that every single day. I can't imagine. I cannot imagine what that must be like.

18:44

You know? Oh, yeah,

18:46

no, it it really must play into the just full, full scale perceptions and way of thinking and when

18:55

and and

18:56

that part is is hard to I'd say, when you're not exposed to that, or you don't really think about that you don't you don't. That doesn't come to your mind. First and foremost, when people talk about police reform, you go, Well, I don't know, the police in my neighborhood don't need it. What do you mean, I've never seen it? Yeah. And I think it's one of those things where it doesn't exist, or people start talking. So one of the things that gets frustrating for me is the immediate reject reaction. Again, both sides have terrible rhetoric. And

Brandon  19:28

because we this is, again, this is not a we have the United States population has a terrible habit of turning things that are like humanitarian crises into political issues, like their politics has no people shouldn't be dying. Right. Right. That's not a no matter what. Right? It's not like the citizens of the United States should not be being killed by law enforcement officers. Right. In my mind, that's not a political issue.

19:59

No, That's not

Brandon  20:00

a, that's not a Oh, my side see something new in it?

20:04

And, and part of that is it, you know, it immediately gets political when you start saying, Okay, what do I do because of it? Right. But that that step Weren't you know, it's just having to just address and acknowledge that something exists, because what you're having to do is you have people who are basically arguing from experiences and encounters to people who have not had those experiences as encounters. And if

20:30

you have people who go,

20:31

I experienced this horrific act, you know, act against me. And I see it time and time again, when people go, Well, you know, statistically, it's actually not that likely to have that kind of event happen.

20:40

And you go, what, if that's

20:45

what I don't see.

Brandon  20:46

Yeah, yeah, you have to, you have to change your statistics. You can't just talk about you have to start talking about demographics and

20:55

well in it. And I think you know, and I've read the statistics on from a lot of different people, and

Collin  21:03

you can get to a point where you can go Okay,

21:04

like I can see

21:07

that all these studies show something. And yet, that doesn't discount, you know, if you say it's 99% likely that this will not happen. Okay, great. What about that other 1%? Is it? I mean, is it okay that that 1% is still happening? Is it okay that those kind of events are still going on? Because people aren't that's happening to people. People are experiencing that. So we need to do something about that. And I feel like when when you just start throwing out when some of the rhetoric is just talking about statistics, as far as quiet on on white on black or black on black or white on black, black on white, whatever, like you, you lose those personal stories, those personal experiences. Yeah, that you need to dress that that humanitarian side of things.

Brandon  21:53

Yeah, if these, this event didn't happen to number

21:58

19 right. I mean, we hear All the time of horrific events happening in other countries overseas where you know, these bombs were dropped in three people killed. We don't sit back and go, Well, you know, there was a 99.999999% chance that no, the whole country wasn't going to get wiped out. So I don't know why you're complaining like it was getting to be.

22:19

Yes.

22:20

You don't hear that you hear three people were murdered by a way word bomb and everybody loses their mind. Three people, but for some reason we look the other way. When we go through people were three innocent people were murdered by police, because of, you know, these underlying things that we've already discussed. Yeah, people go well, that's just police. You go.

Brandon  22:40

Yeah. Are we talking about the same thing? That shouldn't be it though. I mean, I think that every because again, because of my privilege, based on my skin color and where I live, right. My interactions with the police in my whole entire life, have been relatively benign. Right. When I was a youth, when I was like 17 1819 when I got pulled over, I would get kind of a gruff thing. But it's nowhere near like what other people in this country experience and like, you know what I mean? Like I had a cop search my car one time randomly search your car. Why? To the gas station? What are you doing like but it's nowhere near I was the I was never handcuffed was never, you know, detained at all. It was just a Hey, stand over there. We're looking your back seat. Fine, whatever I'm here, but that interaction is much different for other people. And like you said, I don't worry about it. But that's the I have that You know, I guess privileges the word, really, I've never really had to worry about it too much. Because I've never, police aren't afraid of me because of a long and very complicated historical events that people just don't want to talk about. Because it's hard.

24:24

And,

Brandon  24:27

you know, hard conversations are hard and people don't want to deal with it. And so I realized that, you know, it's different, but I still think that everybody should be entitled to my experiences as a police officer, every single person in this country should be entitled to have the same experiences I have. of Hey, license registration. By slow down by, right, yeah, that's it. What, I believe everybody should have that because it's not just stuff is no? Good. It's not. Right. Like it's just a right to be treated like a person. I think that's really upsets me. But not everybody gets that. And I, you know, I don't know how to talk about it, because these are things that I don't really have to address in my community. I don't live in an area that has a large, you know, African American population. We have other issues because I do have I live in a community with an extremely large Hispanic population. So we have some other things we have to deal with. It's, you know, slightly different, but a lot of it is similar in that they're still at malice

25:52

and prejudices assumptions that people bring to it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think you put that very nicely. As far as you know, with your the last time you had a traffic stop where you're pulled over, would you like more people to experience that or fewer people to experience that? And that definitely more. Right. Well, I'm just saying like, like as a thought process for somebody Yeah. going like that should that should tell you a lot about your life experiences just just in that one alone. Right. And I know there are people who don't like, where we grew up, you know. And even where I live now, like, meth definitely, more disproportionately affects the white community than it does the black community. And so, you know, white people in my city right now, like, they get pulled over an awful lot, because that's it, you know, nine times out of 10 they're, they're trafficking something if you know if they're going to be doing it.

26:46

So it's like,

26:47

there there are those instances but but it's, it's it's not even asking, okay, well, stop, stop patrolling black communities so that you don't arrest them or stop patrolling Wikipedia so you don't arrest them. It's everybody the same at all. When you walk up to that car having the same assumptions for the outcome for this car to the next car, the next car next or this house to the next house. Yeah, like, that's where that is.

Brandon  27:11

Yeah, I agree. Because I mean, as a police officer, obviously have to be cautious. Because you never know what's gonna happen, but I don't think you can go it's just so unhealthy to assume that everybody is out to get you all the time. Right. You're constantly under attack all the time. Like this, this mentality that they feed you in some of these departments. It's just not how do you expect anybody to operate under that?

27:47

I don't like I What?

27:51

Now, I think I think to balance it out. We do have to be fair in saying that the people you know, crying out all all cops are bad. No ACA be like, that is a culture in some corners of the United States. So you have both you have this weird side. No, no, I agree. Right? Where you got some, some, some people are going, every comp that I see is a terrible person. And then you have some cop throwing every black person they see as a terrible person and their neighbors, right?

28:21

Yes.

28:22

You've got this unhealthy of like, you have you have people who have been told every comp is is, you know, well I know that. It's just you just one time away from being murdered by a cop that changes how you directly interact with a cop. And then if you are interacting with a cop that has preconceived notions of how a black person's going to respond. You don't get good reactions from both. Yes.

Brandon  28:45

But again, that goes back to unfortunately, that that oftentimes is true in African American community. Right? Like you You are one move away from getting assaulted by Police Officer. Yeah, I mean, oh, yeah. Right. And

29:05

I'm obviously not downplaying that because because those are real feelings. And again, those are real events that have occurred and that they are conscious of. We have some friends down in Arlington, Texas, and they've been posting a lot of stuff in their black family, and we dearly love them and love the business that they have going on. And the grandma has been posting a lot of things. And she was talking about how her son who's actually who's also named as Brandon, he's 32 like him already. You know, he's 32. And she posts a great guy. She posted a picture of him with his his nephew. And it was this beautifully written thing. And I was crying by the end of it because she was comparing and contrasting how her son who's 32 has lived to her grandson, who's now living and like, you know, Brandon is that her son was, you know, he calls him one timers. And how it just takes one time to do not come back from a grocery store run because of a bad assumption on somebody else's part. And now that is differentially applied to the black community. And, and you know, so it was just it really hit home again for those that idea of life experiences that some people have lived very very, very differently in this country and other people in regardless of location or income, or education or anything like that they have lived a completely separate life. Cuz you know, this family is is real is very well to do and is, you know, started multiple businesses and all this stuff. So you don't take that out of the equation. And you still have this, this disparity these these life experiences. I'll never have, again you talk about that word privilege, you know, whatever.

Brandon  31:05

However that

31:06

is manifested, you know, we are all privileged to some extent, you know, everybody in the United States is privileged in to some extent as opposed to other places in the world. And yet, you still have these disparities. Yeah.

31:23

Aaron, you've been awfully quiet. Hi.

Brandon  31:26

As someone who actually works in the social working industry, he endearing to add Yeah, you're crying. Sorry. I was. I was I was eating ice cream, sorry. So someone who actually works with law enforcement, sometimes on a daily basis.

31:44

And for those listeners who don't know if we have anyone new,

Aaron  31:51

I work in child welfare for Osage County, largest county in Oklahoma. Also one of the least populated In the in the whole state, which again, it's Oklahoma, though not saying a whole lot, but yeah, it's, it's, um, but it also has a very large population of Native Americans, particularly the Osage nation. And so, sometimes when I work on some investigations or if law enforcement calls me and I hear the interaction between like law enforcement and like family per se, it there's a lot of times where I had to stop and think like, how did you become a police officer? And then when I talked to one of my best friends here in Oklahoma is actually a county sheriff not for the county I work at and I have a little, you know, back to blue bracelet that he gives me that I wear every once in a while, because I know what he's been through. I know everything that he's gone through and you know, I know that he is himself. A A good, you know, example of law enforcement. But then I hear his stories and some of the people that he has to deal with in law enforcement wise and it's like, well, we don't have, you know, the qualification for being a law enforcement law enforcement officer is honestly not that much. And we're constantly needing people. And so they've kind of I don't want to say lowered the bar or lower the standards for people to become police officers. In a lot of cases, just so they can have the numbers and training kind of gets thrown out the window. But a lot of the times when I deal with with investigations and law enforcement calls me and now they're, they're doing their stuff, and it's like, wow, you have no idea how to talk with people and you're in law enforcement. And then you hear like, oh, how long have you been doing this? I've been doing law enforcement for for 15 years. I'm like, Ah, you're one of Those law enforcement people and so for someone who actually deals quite often or more often than you may think, in law enforcement or having to have interactions with them. They're there. Especially where I'm at, you know, they're not greatly funded there in large chunks of areas with, you know, the crazy of the crazies, AK wood columns talking about with meth. It's very popular. here in Oklahoma, weirdly, I live in very handy for a long time. So the number one meth producer producing capital of the United States. Yeah, and so, so like, but that's in my particular area. Like I, I, myself, don't deal with a lot of Native American or with a lot of African American individuals. For that, you have to Go down to Tulsa, particularly North Tulsa, which part of it is in Osage County. And it's a it's a very different, you know, demographic, you know, when my goofy self shows up and, you know, again, no one's ever happy when the state just shows up. And, you know, I show up with my little OSU Polo and my Hello, I need to talk to you and, and people still have that, you know, that disconnection and then sometimes I had to get law enforcement and they're like, Oh, well, now we'd rather just talk to you. Because we know you're not going to shoot us like, I beg your pardon. What? And then I had to bring myself back to their reality of like, Oh, I, I'm in the situation dealing with this family, that this is a constant for them. And then, on the other end, I deal with Native American families that you know, again, a state official Gave me speaking of marginalized. Yeah. Neighbor, a state official shows up. And they're like, yeah, we're not gonna talk to you. I'm like, Oh, that's right. And so that's fair. Use it and oh my god, don't don't blame me. I will. And so that's usually we have to wait for the

36:21

Native American liaison or a tribal worker to come out and, and work with you. In the obeah, there's, there's still that sometimes it's like, oh, hey, yeah, we're not we're not going to talk to you. Like, Oh, no, fair enough. Yeah. Okay.

Aaron  36:37

But one thing that is kind of weird, you know, talking about, you know, training. My training was like, a few months, and we had a class on, you know, traumatic experiences and it lasted for two hours. And they keep saying it's like, well, you know, put put yourself in their shoes. And, you know, kind of where I'm at. I'm like, how can I And so, kind of taking that concept into law enforcement of trying to put themselves in people choose, you know, the only thing you can do is, you know, have extensive training and be involved in the community. And that's kind of makes myself kind of, you know, our big town at the Husker, the only large town in Osage County. But, you know, people are actually able to recognize me and you know what, I go to people's houses like, Oh, hey, I've seen you at the football game. Oh, yeah, come on in and it makes things vastly different. And it makes things so much easier. When I myself a little random red haired kid, you know, shows up at people's doors and they're like, Oh, hey, I saw you at the restaurant. You know, yeah, you're fine. Come on in and, and then just having that interactions like well, you know, how much easier this will be if this is how it was like all the time, except for there's that stigma of like, Oh, that's Law enforcement, I'm not going to let them in. And it just, it baffles me with some of the people that I see out there talking with people or doing certain things and it's like you, you're you're a police officer, you're you're who they send now you kind of have someone else cuz you don't need to be out here. Damn, it's heartbreaking sometimes. But kind of where I'm at. That's, that's all I know, the resources that we have, unfortunately. And so it's until something changes that. We have to we have to do with what we got. And a lot of times, that's not a lot at all. Yeah, that's I think one of the things you said earlier that I will confess my ignorance to I did not know how much training it actually takes to become a police officer. In some cases, or like you said, How not much training mean that you will receive to become a police officer. I saw the signs at the protests about like, how long it takes to become like a hairdresser versus how long it takes to become a police officer. You know, like the hours involved, and I was like, That can't be true. I looked it up and I was like, Oh, boy, hold on. This is a problem. Like, that's so it's that boggled my mind. I had no idea. That was the case. And that's, that happens a lot and some people are talking or, you know, calling for, you know, different police training, which then makes sense, but also with a lot of these lower funded areas. Again, Washington County or the Osage County, biggest County, not a lot of heavily funds. And so when people talk about how old police officers need, you know, up to Two years of training, a lot of these places can can't afford that, weirdly enough, and most people go the state cannot pay for that. I mean, it ends in that state police officers. Yeah, exactly. It's not. And I wish there was more. But there's some times where I have more experience and more training in the few months that I did training. Then some of these long police officers that I've had to deal with and it's just like, Are you kidding me? How are you even out here? And now, men law enforcement calls me on all the time like, Oh, hey, we got this situation and blah, blah, blah. It's like that. No, no, that you don't Why are you calling me? Yeah, and it's Yeah, it's it's weird on my end. Not there's there hasn't been a lot of stuff like that, or protests or anything going on in bartlesville. But there should have been a lot in Tulsa. Uh, we we haven't been really around that at all. There's someone spring Yeah, they know. Yeah. I saw some big picture some photos of some very large crowds. On the Martin Luther King bridge downtown. Yeah. But

41:12

yeah, you talked about training. And I was one of the things I learned through this was, I had just always believed that part of the police officer training was

Brandon  41:24

de escalation techniques. Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah. I thought that that was just

41:30

a thing police officers would do, because that makes sense in my brain, and I just Yeah, no, no, the vast majority of departments around the country don't have any sort of that training in place. And some do, whether that's a three step or a five step or something, you know, now people are calling for an eight step de escalation process before, you know before you get to the use of deadly force. Yeah, but that that part of me is like, I I'm shocked. I am genius. And they genuinely shocked

42:02

by that. But that's not in place. And I think that's

Brandon  42:06

long overdue. I just I agree. I mean, when you have more SWAT training than you have de escalation training, that's, that's a problem. Yeah. Like that's. Yeah, that's not a healthy situation. No, no. Because in that gets back to kind of what we were talking about as far as

42:29

increasing the diversity of what types of police officers and what that means. Yeah, I think a lot teams are still gonna should still be around. Definitely. 100% I mean, could be a case.

Brandon  42:43

Yeah, like, but that's, that's, they would every once in a while you do. Get that but that is, that's not your first step. That's step one SWAT van is not the norm, right, and it shouldn't be enough. You know, again, there's lots of other things that tie into this and other places but like, you know, just it's very odd. I had another thought and escapes me. You said that was maybe we'll come back. Well, I I don't know if it if it helps or hinders anything. But it's also kind of a good thing Shelby and myself are leaving the state this weekend because our president is coming to Oklahoma coming to Tulsa. Yeah. This this this weekend, so it's literally the I don't Yeah, yeah. I don't know how that hurts me.

43:41

You're not planning on driving through. You don't drive through there. Right.

Brandon  43:44

Nope. Right. Okay. Yeah. Which is the B okay. Dinner. Yeah, but is that next downtown Right. Yeah. Okay, so we're actually not that far from downtown. Yeah. Oh the hour from us. But now we are Drive drives that's straight. It's right. It's on the road. We drive straight West. Or straight east. There we go. safe. Why are you going the wrong way? It's been a very route. But we were driving straight East tomorrow, so we will be far, far away from any any big things going on but he's not coming in till tomorrow. Hey, about that still that that timing. Yeah, I can I cannot believe. I mean, I can't believe because I mean why would you not? If you're that person, why would you not do something that completely insensitive and terrible. I

44:58

can't

Brandon  45:01

Having a rally on the anniversary one of the worst like

45:07

you know yeah

Brandon  45:14

yeah so that's that's that's happening this weekend our our governor is not not really help anything but I mean, I guess it's why it's Yeah, I that's so that's that's going on and I guess that's another reason why I was like yeah, we'll probably need to head home and see and see the family and yeah. That's Other than that, that's, that's what we're gonna be. Yeah, good call. Yeah, man. That's good. What a slap in the face. I

46:20

Puts puts the different thing but to bring a different different mood into the

Brandon  46:28

podcast save us seems to me to brag to brag on my on my wonderful girlfriend who I cherish dearly. She made some new new friends this weekend. Um, so she she was out jogging around our apartment complex. And as you bring some more birds home, man, no, they're currently well so there are the squirrels. They're all too old now. So they're kind of like hovering over the doorway directly so they can all fit In the bird's nest, so did you buy the Shelby? No, no. Okay, no, I wish. Oh, no. Okay. But we she was out jogging and she made some friends. And there's this very old lady in a wheelchair with one leg. And she has like this. It's not a service dog. It's a little tiny, like, old. It's like a 15 year old dog. And it's anybody and it's like, does it's super cute. And so Shelby starts a conversation and then gets invited into this elderly couples home and who the grandpa I guess you would say is very diabetic and is pretty much blind. And then the this lady has one leg and has a wheelchair bound. And all this stuff. They don't have any family members in town and so they think for the mood of the day Yeah. Man, what is up beat store? Hey, they have been, they have been blowing up Shelby's phone. And it's like the it's they're they're really sweet. But they're like, Hey, we need help. Like we just ran in, got some groceries for them not that long ago. But you guys have your birds. And I don't know, I haven't asked them. Hey, so we came back and she's like, Oh, I met these really old people and then like the next day, I think they call them like I called her like, two or three times. And then they called today when we were because we went to the pool. And it swam, they called us and then they're like, they need some other groceries. I was like, Oh, this is how exactly I pictured us making making friends. But

48:47

you know, whatever. That's been that's been our

Brandon  48:52

evening. Tonight at least is making friends with the elderly couple. A few rows down from us. There you go getting out meeting the neighbors. Right? How sociable Have you? Right?

49:08

Good job.

Brandon  49:11

Like I said, they're they're really sweet but it's just like you. You ran into Who who are you talking to? And I was like, Oh, I'm sure we won't have to talk too much. And then just today just like oh, Who's calling? Oh easy. Okay. Called 47 times. But now we'll be we'll be heading home this weekend for the first time Joby gets to meet everybody and then first time I'll be back then was almost home. Chris was it? No, yeah. Well, I mean, if we look at the timeline, it was Christmas, January apocalypse. Yeah, that's all I mean. Yeah, but yeah, so I sent me home. I don't know if apocalypse is basically that way. No, no, it's been. Yes. Yes. I gotcha. Yeah. So that'll be the Wow. Yeah, she I didn't realize that because all the times like man, it'd be fun to come home that'd be like, no, I gotta get you right now.

50:25

So yeah, that's what that's what we we got and

Brandon  50:30

anything else happened this weekend or this week and just dispute associations here and there. Yeah, other than that, that's that's all then and bartles away. There we go. I was trying to think of anything else I need to rant about if I saw some high school kids driving in new new vehicles are not nearly see anybody driving right in the middle of the road. Publix I'm just kidding I'm dating sweet. I'm surviving summer school. I barely know it's hot now. And it's hot. We started service project we got I was really bored of being inside all day long. So we are now in addition to the other things we were doing, also doing some landscape maintenance. The front of the school felt nice was like raking leaves and pulling weeds and stuff cuz Yeah, good. We got we're doing it like the first hour of school. School starts like eight. Yeah, eight, so it's not real hot yet. So we're going outside, doing that a little bit, just kind of helping out doing some stuff. Also, the maintenance director might have suggested that If we do a good enough job, he will let us go into look at the basement. A place that the kids did not know existed until this week. So we're gonna excellent. There's an old boiler room under the old gym. Yes. And it is like, often flooded and often has some standing water in the bottom. And it's really weird. And possibly haunted. It's fine. And then we're gonna

52:42

love it.

Brandon  52:44

Because we do have a school ghost by way we talk right, you know, and if you don't that night, we have a school ghost. So we're going to, we might get to go take a peek in the basement. Like earlier this week, we were doing something else. Oh, we help the new librarian. Move some stuff right now. So our old librarian retired. And actually Aaron knows our new librarian Michelle Hilburn, formerly flamer, right. Oh, really is the new heroine in our school. And so she was moving stuff from her, cuz she taught English before. So she taught English there. She actually taught English at rogersville when Aaron was there, column, I never I never had her though. But yeah, knows her. She tells me he would just like wander into a class and sit down sometimes. I don't know what he was doing

53:36

exactly like Aaron.

Brandon  53:39

Not in class. But that might have happened. Actually, I was there and she asked about him every once in a while. And so she's there. So she was the new librarian Anyway, she had to move a bunch of stuff. And jokingly one day I was like, hey, if you need some help, I got a bunch of really bored sixth graders in here. As you emailed me later was like, hey, but for real though, I have some boxes. So we got some carts and boxes and we move some stuff around for a little while. And while we were doing that, we had to go to something else and one of the janitors one of the new guys who's like, super awesome, right? He started showing the kids around just some closets. You know, like, Oh, hey, have you ever seen it here? And he opened up this closet, it's under the stairs. They didn't even know it was there. They're like, What? What's in there? And, and, you know, he showed him one and he's like, have you seen the other one? And they're like, there's so they were just getting these behind the scenes looks of all these doors that are always closed and they have no idea what's in there. Yeah. And so they were getting like this look and like we have a one you know, He's like, Hey, you know, come check this out. Do you know what that box is? And they're like, no, what's that box is like that's the controls for the elevator. Like that's so cool. So we've been getting some behind the scenes look at it's cool. taking a peek in there also ripping up the gym floor. Oh, I saw that on the social media posts. Yeah. With the can't think of his name the janitor. Yeah. Glenn. He's the maintenance guy. Yeah, that one guy. Yeah, that was so sweet. So did you see that one column? No, I didn't. Alright, so they're tearing up the floor. This floor has been there since 1974. Cool. Okay. That's how this is. It's got a had water got in somehow and it started moving around so much that you can't actually put the volleyball posts in anymore because it shifted. Geez. So they're tearing it out. They're redoing some of the fixing some of the concrete. They're putting a new floor down. Well, the maintenance director name is Glenn. Right? He played the first basketball game on the new floor when he was in high school there. So he played on the basketball team, the first game on the new floor. And so right before they started sewing it up and taking it away. He went out and shot baskets on the basketball floor, so he is now the last person to play basketball on the floor. also really cool. So there's this cool thing, too. He asked Susan if he could do that. Yeah, doing that right now. So that's pretty cool. And then they've sawn it up. And they have actually taken a bunch of the pieces out to the ag building. And they're selling them to people. They cut up these big, some of them are enormous. And they're just like, yep. Come get, you know, like, I remember, it's like, it's not very much like 10 bucks, 20 bucks, something like that. Like, take a piece of the floor. Come get it. Go for it. So he's like, I got five. And I don't know what I'm gonna do with them, but I got so they go out hold this floor out there. That's really funny. Yeah, that's the things going on too. That's a big construction project that's happening is cool. For checking that out. We've been peeking in on that too, as we go by now. Yeah. The gym looks really weird with no bleachers on that side. And no floor.

57:54

Yeah.

Brandon  57:57

So that's been happening. That's Yeah, that's kind of cool thing. They did there with him and stuff but anyway. Yeah, we just been kind of roaming around the school in the morning, doing stuff helping out practicing our citizenship because you know, sometimes we don't get along with each other very well. We can't play kickball successfully some days without arguing. So we need to practice working together and giving back because we can't we got to get it under control my handle this very well. It's not the Olympics. Stop what shouting about recessing? There's only six of you anyway, some days. Why are you shouting? How do you play kickball? That may be why you folks stop just understand the drive to succeed. Man. I definitely do not understand life. I definitely do not understand the drive to succeed to kickball. Even when I was in elementary school and playing kickball. I was like Yep. Okay, now, I kicked the ball.

58:58

Most the time I did.

Brandon  59:01

Whenever I remember coach Coach Scott yelling at us to then play attempt to play kickball, then we'd have to remake the rules. Because we apparently weren't playing right dia coach Scott so I don't remember playing a lot of kids. We played kickball in like elementary school but by the time I had coach Scott, we're playing lots and lots of two bass inside. Yeah, with the big. The big pads. Yeah. One of the only remember memories I have to base. The best memory I have was playing somewhere. I guess it must have been summer school because I didn't take PE in high school. We talked about this. I haven't got time for that. And lady. Tim, his brother Brent was mouthing off at me. He was there. It was mouthing me you could give me out. Oh, so we kicked the ball very hard. I grabbed it. And I was at one of the Jim and he was running to the other one and I flung the ball like most of the way across the gym and hit him right in the shoulder blades. Bam, horse. He did. He did. Like, I'm not gonna eat you. What was that? He said that's the end of my competitive streak right there. Oh, you can't get me out. Oh, yeah, watch this. Boom. Okay. I don't care for one. I just got you out. That's all it's important. Great. I'm not petty at all sometimes. Fine. I don't know what you're talking about. Who, who was the elementary school PE teacher. Now I had three. So you got to be more specific than that. Okay, this coach Evans was Yes. was a teacher but I'm talking I'm talking about like Oh there lady, or was it? I had a guy named brandy, too when I was in second grade. But the lady nice Thompson. Yeah. Yes. Coach Thompson because Tom so it was I think it was coach Thompson but So recently I don't know long brown hair tall. Do you know what happened? her? No. killed by a car while she was in Pittsburgh going to a baseball game. What? This was several years ago. No, I had no idea. Yes. So she was struck by she was a pedestrian struck by car sorry to bring down your game here. But I know so I was. I was what I was going to say was um, so the ESPN just released a new 3430 about Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa and I remember in gym class Coach Thompson like, or just like wheel out one of those TVs. And we would watch like a baseball game because she was super into market wire. As was literally everybody, everybody. Yeah. Well, they didn't never watch baseball in their entire life. It's kind of like last year when the Chiefs one of the people like I love the Chiefs like you don't even watch football. Who are you? What are you talking about? It was like that. I love foots. Yes. But I just I just remember that that was kind of like my big step into into baseball. But I was we're all sitting there watching and I was following on Twitter. And I was like, I remember when that was like, super serious. And I just remember our PE teacher just like not doing PE things. We just watch baseball. Yes. Well I had when he was at home or anything, but yeah, she was. She was killed. I'm pretty sure she was killed by a car. She was she was watching a baseball game. Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh. Yeah, she's going to baseball game where she was either going to or leaving a baseball game. And she was killed by a car. So unfortunate. I do remember that.

63:18

Wow. Yeah.

Brandon  63:22

Sorry to bring your story down slightly. No, no, it's fine. No, yeah, I had no idea. I definitely remember coach Evans, but I could not remember. clemson. Thompson. Ah, yeah. I can't remember her first name. I have some yearbooks somewhere in this house. Because Susan found them at dad's house and was like, nope, these are coming home with us now. It's like no, no, we don't need those. It's fine. Put them away. Yeah. Then I think she has them in the room. They're either in the bedroom or the other closet. So I have to get that out. See if I can find it later but yes I don't mind you're scattered somewhere around here. Shelby is is extremely excited to look at the photo album photo albums. And I was like, haha, good thing I was like oh no meanie and just the copious amounts of money. Yeah. And so I was like ah, Dragon foiled though. Yeah, you sound so sad. Oh no. Oh, she gets to look at my adorable cute pictures. Look at it look outside your well hurt her and go oh, look how cute I was. Help me stop. Yeah. Oh, please don't look at this adorable picture of me. No, don't wear this one. Yeah, or if you saw this one. Yeah. I really hate it. If you saw how cute I was in this picture, specifically But why are you holding a fishing pole in your school picture? Don't worry about it. Don't worry about First of all, that was a stick. goober. He didn't know the fishing pole. We know it was a stick you found that I'm talking about the one with the little small one. Oh, no, I was talking about one where you wouldn't sit still unless you held that ball and that domestic mom's like, fine. Let him hold it. I don't really care. Don't remember that. But I do. You wouldn't sit still. You're just like you were you were like, or I'm pretty sure you're like if you were old enough to be in school. I would just like, this is like last year. It was yesterday. Nobody was sitting up. They put you on this little stool and you just kept getting up and walking off. You'd be like, all right, as you just get up and walk off the stage. And the only way you would sit still is you were holding a yellow kickball and a stick. A stick to your playground. You really wanted that ball. So the picture of Aaron is him. Cindy got this tool like nice sweater. And like this weird background he's just holding a yellow kickball stick like

66:05

now I have happy by my lawyer myself remember this quite differently, but

Brandon  66:13

I witnessed this whole thing. I that's exactly what happened. I don't even yeah so we'll be we'll be spinning spinning some time and looking at those cuz it's like I'm so excited I was like oh crap but she's I was gonna say I was questioning her excitement level because surely she listens she's in the room right now while you're talking to us and she's got to be going. Oh my gosh your brothers are so dumb. Why would she she can't she can't hear. She can't hear what y'all are saying she is hearing me commenting just sitting here quietly in the being like I looked very cute. Yes. Just like that. The blue is so good about your face. What? She literally just looked at me and said Why? And I was like yeah, I think I'm good at imagining good meds now. I just I just questioning her excitement level. I'm very curious about why you'd be so Exactly.

67:20

Oh no, she's she's very excited that I told her about the dad's puppies and so

Brandon  67:27

we can't so they eaten the whole entire house yet. Oh.

67:32

They told for more rocks. It's it's not puppies name anymore. Oh, was it? Um, nothing. Nothing bad. But, but Becky has found a new home.

Brandon  67:50

Which one was that? The black one. The black one? Yep.

67:55

She was quite the instigator. And was really the basically turning Addie against him attachments like like, that's it, you're out of here. And so he found a family who had just lost the dog who wanted his dog and he had a dog, the dog. Okay. Oh, so re homed

68:15

Okay, that's better. I said nothing bad happened. Yeah, no but

Brandon  68:18

it first you didn't you were like it's only one I was like, oh god, oh what happened? Right? So it's just Addy. Okay. Well, yeah, I'm slightly sad news. But I don't understand why a man would buy or procure for himself one of the most rambunctious breed of dogs of all time. And then be confused when they like, acted rambunctious Lee, you know, when they were six months old. I know. That's a confusing step in there. They don't fully know And I know and I know, you know.

69:06

I don't know. Yeah.

Brandon  69:12

Well, well at least it was. There was no tragic accident. I'd be worried there. Go go. No.

69:19

All right, I'd probably take that a little bit more seriously, just because I had to explain to the kids whenever we were there last like it's only Wow. And they were very confused. Like, it was like, Did he actually rehome her or is that like the arm in the sky kind of thing?

Brandon  69:39

Oh, dear. Oh, dear.

69:42

It's like of course even older. She's like,

69:45

Okay. And then then

69:49

maybe then you're like, wait, Dad, you actually did make it did make it.

69:53

She's like, get omega get.

69:56

She took. He told her. He was like she just didn't write out and when Did you actually rehome him? He was like,

70:05

like, I'm breathe.

Brandon  70:10

Good. We'll get you. psu. Like don't do that. So you'd be double team. I'm Megan and Susan, so you don't even want that

70:21

get out.

70:23

Wow.

70:28

Oh, my gosh.

70:40

Well, alright, one doc. Mm hmm. So

Brandon  70:46

yeah, you guys, enjoy that. That'll be fun. We'll see. It's going to be hot, but it's alright. I suppose it's He's Sorry, it's the one that we can that you actually have to Doug's it again. I the first time since the world is ended that you're actually okay. It's okay.

71:15

We are I need to send you guys the date that we are trying to back up. It's many weeks away, down bokor down, down, up, across, whenever not across

Brandon  71:30

kind of across. I mean, yes. D it's across. It's kind of up ish. But anyway, yeah, just so you guys get on your counter and we can try and do one of these other live in person thing. Oh, yeah. listeners we'd love you awesome.